bk450 gasket on k1200RS
Turbo Mini Forums

Hi guys,

I had a head gasket failure today, specialist compeoents cometic one. I've just tried to fit the BK450 as someone on here said they work, you just need to drill new holes for the different stud pattern.

When ive gone to fill with water, its pouring out the back of the head / block. Am i missing something obvious, is there actually anyone running this gasket with a twincam and is there any further mods that need to be done to the head / gasket for it to be compatible.

P.S. if there is anyone in the Edinburgh area that has a spare head gasket i can buy off them tonight, i might just be able to get racing again tomorrow....

Thanks,
Nick

I've dry decked my head, and believe all the others that run the bk450 have also done the same. I'm not to sure if its possible to run a bk450 it hour dry decking, or at least blocking off a few of the water galleries.

Edited by matty on 17th May, 2014.

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1/4mile in 13.2sec @ 111 terminal on 15psi

hmm, if you've killed the sc one definately check the afr's and ignition timing. not heard of one fail and they look substancial.

Specialist components don't do a cometic gasket, but I believe MED do.

In the past, I've had to rebuild an engine that had a SC head gasket failure.

As said though, if you are going to use the BK450 gasket, you need to dry deck the head and block or its piss water everywhere

Sorry, yeah. Its not cometic, that was what i had fitted before the head conversion. SC ones are Ferriday Engineering bi-metallic ones.

I havent dry decked the head, so that would explain the water pouring out!! The post i read failed to mention that was a requirement .

This is the state of the gasket:



Was only cylinder 2 that was blowing, although plenty damage to 1 and 3 also...

I'm wondering in the fire ring went slightly out of alignment when i torqued down the head and that could explain the damage to all 3 cylinders? Or its seen way too much boost somehow?!

I wasnt data logging at the time so couldnt tell you AFR's or boost levelsbut the timing is fine. I'm going to buy the MED gasket and do some runs with the laptop scope / data logging to check everything is as it should be.

Holy smoke...

I run a supercharger and I don't care the TB is on the wrong side.
VEMS + 12 PSI + Liquid Intercooler = Small Bore FUN!

When I said I experienced a failure of one of those gaskets, it certainly never looked like that.

At first glance I am thinking of two possible issues. Firstly, poor cylinder head clamping and second, Detonation.

What sort of ignition advance do you have when on boost?

What head studs are you using and what do you torque them too? Do you use the correct torquing sequence?

Edited by Sprocket on 18th May, 2014.

Did you drive over that repeatedly before taking a picture?
I'm seriously wondering whaaaaat the fuuuuuuuuck....

Holy shit, what's happend there!

I never had a problem with my SC gasket. Did you anneal it before installing it, and each time it was fitted?

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1/4mile in 13.2sec @ 111 terminal on 15psi

Never annealed it when new or refitting (it was also 5+ years old i think). First i've heard of the technique but it does sound worthwhile when using a copper gasket!

I've ordered a steel one from MED, which is a bit thicker and should help with my compression ratio too.

Will get it all built back up with the new gasket and let it get up to temp, then remove the cams (AGAIN) for a final torgue down and hopefully that should be the end of it.

Got a test day on Sunday, where i'll start off on actuator boost and do some logging. If everything looks ok, i'll start to bring the boost back up. Was only meant to be 0.8bar max, but im wondering if the 1mm reducer i added to the boost line to the N75 is restricting too much and its spiking.... It was spining the 7.5" soft compound slicks in 3rd which i thought was a bit mental!

Wow. I've had a few head gaskets go, but that is on a whole new level.

In the 13's at last!.. Just

Ive had a further 2 head gaskets go on the car . Its getting to be quite an expensive consumable.....

After head gasket 2 went, i was convinced the radiator wasnt up to the job, so bought a new uprated item and although it has improved stationary cooling hugely, the car still gets hot very quickly and its not the solution to my problems.

Few issues that might be causing this:

*running lean - dont think so, as it was setup on RR and i havent touched the map. Havent had a chance to validate with my own lamda as i dont have a gauge and the logging isnt working

*air in the head - possible, its probably the highest point in the system, but i would of thought the pump and general use would push this through....

*water volume - the holes that flow from block to head are tiny, and the gasket half covers some of these too... I think there is not enough circulation of cool / warm water, the head is getting very hot and the small volume cant cool the head quick enough and its boiling. The water temp sensors have never seen higher than 10degrees, so it sounds like hot spots and uneven temps through the head / cooling system.

The only thing i have left to try us dry decking, which will hopefully help with all of the above. I've read a few posts on this topic for these conversions but ive tried to summarise the steps below. Can someone confirm if im missing anything?

*Assume the head has to be stripped back to bare casting?
*Heat up head and fill all waterways
*face flat
*weld in / outlet pipes - what the best location/ solution for this?
* plug block - whats the best solution for this?
*face flat block
*reroute some plumbing pipes
build it all back up and done?!


Any help would be very much appreciated!

Thanks,
Nick

is the head still straight? and I mean front to back as well as side to side?

turbo 16v k-series 11.9@118.9 :)

Denis O'Brien.

I'm pretty confident it isnt AFR issues, but these things are never 100%..... Its fine at actuator boost, and the fueling is just impacted by a pressure multiplier as far as i understand it. Its going back to the RR for checking once its all built back up anyway.

Dont know if the head / block are straight, wont know until its all in bits and checked prior to the dry deck work.

Does my dry deck checklist make sense? Any words of wisdom to add?

Your list looks about right. There's some photos on my build thread showing what you need to do and where everything goes. I'm assuming as its a k1200 so will have external oil feed already.

Also, ive read on here that there seems to be a bit of debate about whether to run a thermostat or not. I dont, and didnt run one for the last 2-3 years with complete reliability. NOt sure if this could be a contributing factor in the turbo saga or not...

Does your rolling road use a massive big fan at the front of the car which is keeping the engine temps right down, so your tune doesn't represent the real world environment it's used in?

Ignition timing?

I ran mine with a copper gasket for 2 years without any overheating problems, and i only had small 4/5mm drillings in the block to head. What temperature did the engine run at?

Any pictures of plugs, pistons etc?

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1/4mile in 13.2sec @ 111 terminal on 15psi

The water comes out the welded in adaptor on the end of the head and in the front core plug hole on the end of the block just below. You need to make/buy an adaptor to go on the block end and a 32mm 180 degree hose bend to connect them up. It's pretty simple stuff.

I would go with the dry deck, just means a bit of extra work but could solve a lot of problems. I don't know much about the AFR yet.