Wideband O2 Sensor
Turbo Mini Forums

Evening chaps,

next thing on my list to sort out is a wideband kit, and after looking around on fleebay i cant decide between these two

The AEM kit
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171429239500?_tr...K%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

And this kit that logs data
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/INNOVATE-DB-BLUE...=item1c371e8e8e

which one is best and why?

thanks in advance

stu

a lot of folks on here are using the AEM one with good results,

the early LC1 inovate could be problematic, i had one and ended up swapping to somthing else, but I'd hope thats sorted now

I've used a few Innovate stuff...and probably wouldnt buy again.

Even when they do work well....they eat sensors.

I havent used the AEM...but rarely do you see a bad report.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will

http://www.jbperf.com/

I've got the Innovate one fitted and it seems to be working just fine.

Metric is for people who can't do fractions.

I'm very happy with the AEM.

For either UEGO, if you intend to use the 5V analogue output, make sure it has a good earth and make sure you calibrate it in your software so it reads the same as on the dial. Not a fault, but I found the documented AEM calibration was incorrect.

Edited by PhilR on 12th Feb, 2015.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will

http://www.jbperf.com/

Thanks for the replies chaps. So the AEM has issues, and the Innovate can be fussy with sensors. Is the datalogging of any use with the Innovate? Is there another unit that i should be looking at?

Stu

i have 2 AEM UEGO settups,
one over 5 year old still working and
one on my daily drive for the last 2n half years

only thing that pisses me off with them is the high pitch buzz, both of them do it but the one in the skyline comes through my tweeters, low volume but very high pitch
i re wired my entire audio system properly to get around this and it still does it
google it, its all over the net, AEMs official reply is use a better earth
well i wired it up to run from a completely separate battery and the tweeters still buzz while the power is on :(

Edited by Brett on 12th Feb, 2015.

Yes i moved to the darkside

Instagram @jdm_brett

Edited by PhilR on 15th Feb, 2015.

I certainly wouldnt trust Innovate's analogue outputs.

One one car where I fed the output to a Motec for logging purposes only...even when the Innovate's output was flatlined..it say huge voltage swings.

It may also have been a wiring issue, as when driving it didnt seem so bad, either way it still wasnt good.

Daytona Sensors make some decent looking units, although not the cheapest.

NGK used to have their AFX unit, but seems even it has changed now...and doesnt sound like for the better

The yank FAST one's actually look quite nice, again never used one though

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will

I've mentioned this in another thread but I have had an Innovate fail and so has Graham (he sent his to me to double check as we both use the same ECU setup that reads their digital data, not the usual analogue).
On mine, after starting with getting erratic data, it started throwing up the error code that the sensor had failed.... (it hadn't).

At that time I was only using mine for a third reading after the turbo so wasn't too worried.
I had already started mainly using TechEdge because, when I decided on going down the siamese code injection route (and henced needed a second wideband), the talk on the web about Innovate un-reliability put me off buying a second one.

TechEdges are a bit pricey - unless you buy the DIY version (like I did) - but were reliable for me.

Then, when my needs changed further, I moved everything to 14point7 controllers.
That is why I know there is nothing wrong with the sensor the Innovate was reporting as defective - the 14point7 stuff I use can read the internal operating temperature of the sensor, which is a very good indicator of it's health, and they all run at 750C +/-2 which is well within the Bosch specification.

No experience with AEM and, in fairness to Innovate, the two failures I've seen were on early LC-1 units.
The link at the top of this thread is to a later model.

One final point, whilst every man and his dog are selling Innovates and AEMs on eBay, the likes of TechEdge and 14point7 don't appear (well, not that I've seen) so you have to buy direct or from an authorised agent.
I'm just saying, eBay isn't the only place to do your shopping.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Edited by PhilR on 13th Feb, 2015.

For a couple of years I've used two sets of Innovate. Without any problems. One set is permanently fitted in my mini, making the normal road my roller road when used in combination with a Gtech Pro.
The other set is the fancy one with all the electronics in the clock itself. Used for calibrating many cars from Citroen Ami '63 till Ferrari 400i.
Important to have the sensor in the right position to avoid thermoshock and water influence. The other thing to be aware of is a proper mass.

Dont know about the technicalities but the A35 has used an AEM for the last 5 years or so and I have relied on the readings to run up to 17psi without any apparent problems,

Car has now run for 7 years in turbo form , just under 20000 miles

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-H4ceCOMXHY

A quick google shows it's been mentioned on many car forums.

https://www.google.co.uk/#q=aem+wideband+issues

I have to admit, I wasn't aware of it but I've never considered using that make.

Also, PhilR mentions it 6th post down in this thread.

(EDIT - typo)

Edited by Rod S on 14th Feb, 2015.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

To be clear, my AEM was not inaccurate. The quoted 5V calibration data was miles out, but was easy to spot and correct. You shouldn't rely on any other sensor output without checking the calibration.

I wouldn't read too much into the Google results. Search for any product and "issues" and you'll get results (many old results in this case).

Edited by PhilR on 15th Feb, 2015.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

The controller reads the sensor output, calculates the AFR value and displays it straight onto the digital display (A). From that same AFR value, the controller then generates a 0-5V signal (B).

If (B) is derived from (A) Why would you consider that (B) is correct and (A) is wrong? This isn't logical. Just calibrate (B) so that it matches (A).

If you still question the accuracy of (A) because you don't have calibration gas, this argument applies to all controllers and you may as well throw them all in the bin.

This is what I saw when I set mine up:
(EDIT: By definition, the 5 volt output is a straight line, not to be confused with graphs of the curved line milliamp output of the sensor itself)

One line represents the documented 0-5V calibration, the other is the calibration I ended up using to get the 0-5V reading the same as the display reading.

This was a few years ago, so I'm not 100% sure on the figures off the top of my head, except that they crossed perfectly at 2.5 V /14.7 AFR. Clearly no indication of a DC offset /earthing fault, just calibration.

(Although not a problem for me) I fully agree that having a 0-5V signal without it's own signal ground wire is asking for trouble. On one of AEM's higher spec USB models, the manual show a separate signal ground, but I'd assume for the AEM models above, it is still missing.

Edited by PhilR on 14th Feb, 2015.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2007/06...otout/index.php



http://www.zeitronix.com/press/afrshootout1.shtml


http://www.newtiburon.com/forums/engine-ma...r-shootout.html

Edited by robert on 14th Feb, 2015.

Medusa + injection = too much torque for the dyno ..https://youtu.be/qg5o0_tJxYM

Robert, I have to pay $19.95 to see the results and I don't think the ones I use are in there.

But I agree entirely that they aren't all the same..

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???