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maccamcvey

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Worral Sheffield

http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=496805

NKS one here... not sure if the guys still around to ask if it was any good


coopdog

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On 28th May, 2014 Carlzilla said:
That is a handy article, not just on how well they performed but also on how well they filtered. Wouldn't catch me putting a HKS filter on anything any time soon!

http://www.supracentral.com/foundation/con...ion-kit-review/


nice read


jamestar

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Devon

I've got one of the apexi ones waiting to go on mine after reading that article a couple years ago!


stevieturbo

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Northern Ireland




On 27th May, 2014 Sprocket said:
K&N needs to be specifically selected for the application. Naturaly aspirated filters are different from forced induction filters. If you use a naturally aspirated filter on forced induction it will let shit through. Its all to do with the way the k&n filters work.

It's the same for their 357i induction kits, its a denser filter.


K&N specify this somewhere ? Or even offer this ?

Cant say Ive ever heard of it, or seen anywhere you can specify.

Airflow is airflow, dirt is dirt whether boosted or not. Makes no difference.

The only thing that changes is the volume of air, and that's largely down to power, not method of induction.

Either way, if it's filtration you need, stick with paper or an OEM style filter.

Modern cars even making 200+ run pretty small filters these days. So there really isnt any need for a huge filter. And OEM filters will filter.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


Carlzilla

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Quarry Bonk

What did you do regarding the neck that bolts to it? Because the smallest one they do is still rather large for something like a T3, a silicone reducer or a home made neck?

On 26th Jan, 2012 Tom Fenton said:
ring problems are down to wear or abuse but although annoying it isn't a show stopper

On 5th Aug, 2014 madmk1 said:
Shit the bed! I had snapped the end of my shaft off!!

17.213 @ 71mph, 64bhp n/a (Old Engine)


Turbo Phil

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Lake District


We were told this by David Vizard & this was confirmed by the K&N rep that was there to.

Phil.


On 30th May, 2014 stevieturbo said:



On 27th May, 2014 Sprocket said:
K&N needs to be specifically selected for the application. Naturaly aspirated filters are different from forced induction filters. If you use a naturally aspirated filter on forced induction it will let shit through. Its all to do with the way the k&n filters work.

It's the same for their 357i induction kits, its a denser filter.


K&N specify this somewhere ? Or even offer this ?

Cant say Ive ever heard of it, or seen anywhere you can specify.

Airflow is airflow, dirt is dirt whether boosted or not. Makes no difference.

The only thing that changes is the volume of air, and that's largely down to power, not method of induction.

Either way, if it's filtration you need, stick with paper or an OEM style filter.

Modern cars even making 200+ run pretty small filters these days. So there really isnt any need for a huge filter. And OEM filters will filter.

WWW.TURBO-MINI.COM


Sprocket

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On 30th May, 2014 stevieturbo said:



On 27th May, 2014 Sprocket said:
K&N needs to be specifically selected for the application. Naturaly aspirated filters are different from forced induction filters. If you use a naturally aspirated filter on forced induction it will let shit through. Its all to do with the way the k&n filters work.

It's the same for their 357i induction kits, its a denser filter.


K&N specify this somewhere ? Or even offer this ?

Cant say Ive ever heard of it, or seen anywhere you can specify.

Airflow is airflow, dirt is dirt whether boosted or not. Makes no difference.

The only thing that changes is the volume of air, and that's largely down to power, not method of induction.

Either way, if it's filtration you need, stick with paper or an OEM style filter.

Modern cars even making 200+ run pretty small filters these days. So there really isnt any need for a huge filter. And OEM filters will filter.


I agree that a good paper filter is best and change it often.

I read some test data carried out by a very well renowned engine tuner that showed the foam filters to be the worst for both air flow and filtration. The K&N came out on top on both counts with a decent paper filter next. Basically the foam filter was worse than a good paper filter! but like I said earlier, the popular common trend seems to take precedence over all else wether its any good or not. My own experience of the foam filter compares with this. Dry they were reasonable in air flow but filtered fuck all. Oiled they were very restrictive but did filter much better.

The key to the way the K&N "Filtercharger" works is down to the loose ends of the cotton fibres of the gauze and the oil. You have to ask yourself how this filter works when you can see daylight though it, there are clearly holes in it. The key is the way the air moves through the filter. The induction of the engine is not a constant flow. As the 'pulsing air flow passes over these oiled loose cotton fibres, they vibrate. This vibration 'scrubs' the dirt from the air and the oil grabs hold of it.

Stick the same filter infront of a turbocharger, and those little fibres no longer vibrate, so they no longer scrub the air, and shit gets through. K&N resolve this with extra layers of gauze, that being THE differnece.

I'd expect the Universal filters to have the extra layers of gauze for them to be truely 'universal'

On 26th Oct, 2004 TurboDave16v said:
Is it A-Series only? I think it should be...
So when some joey comes on here about how his 16v turbo vauxhall is great compared to ours, he can be given the 'bird'...


On 26th Oct, 2004 Tom Fenton said:
Yep I agree with TD........


Turbo This..

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Australia, brisbane

I have a cunning plan...

Involves a custom air box above the wheel with baffles and a big flat papor elemt or two


evolotion

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thats my plan, but with a bmw paper cone as you would find in a 530d for example.. easier to make a box for

turbo 16v k-series 11.9@118.9 :)

Denis O'Brien.


stevieturbo

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So where does K&N list this option ? You'd think if available, it would be glaringly obvious on it's website ?


On 30th May, 2014 Turbo This.. said:
I have a cunning plan...

Involves a custom air box above the wheel with baffles and a big flat papor elemt or two


ERA was just an open chamber with the element inside, no baffles. Still well designed though and element size even in paper would easily cope with 200hp.

If insistent on an open style clamp filter, I used this on my turbo many years ago before I bought the ERA air box.

Simple paper, clamp on bit is around 2.5" diameter hard plastic.. ie flexible hose can clamp over it.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BOLK-BOL-B031232...=item43c2c1c4ba


9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


Turbo This..

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Previously josh4444

Australia, brisbane

ill be going for the most surface area i can get in paper that will still fit under the wheel arch the baffles will be to equalize the flow over the whole element rather than taking the easiest route should make it filter better as not to be forced threw but to ease its way threw

the bit im sort of stuck with is getting dry dirt free air into the box from the wheel arch ie so it can be driven on un sealed roads and not suck up a bunch of dirt n rocks im thinking a cyclonic type deal like bag less vacuum cleaners?


stevieturbo

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I just routed the box down to the front air intake normally used for the side vent inside the car.

Pretty sure that's what ERA did too.

I wouldnt worry about baffles. Air will naturally find it's own easy path through the filter, and as the filter gets dirty that will change anyway.

The Peugeot airbox for the filter posted above might actually fit in the arch too. Would be tight though.

Is using small wheels probably ok, 13"...maybe a bit harder.

I'd say you're also overthinking about physical size you might need.

I know this is an extreme comparison, but a WRC car can make 350hp whilst sucking through a 32mm restrictor.
That's a pretty damn small hole to have to draw air through.

So even if your inlet tubing dropped to say 50-55mm...I cant see it causing any real restriction even at 300hp, which few Mini A-series will ever make.

Edited by stevieturbo on 31st May, 2014.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


Brett

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a bit more reading si

http://www.skylineowners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=214527

Yes i moved to the darkside *happy*

Instagram @jdm_brett


skolawn

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Coventry

yup ERA routed it to air intake


Sprocket

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On 30th May, 2014 stevieturbo said:



On 27th May, 2014 Sprocket said:
K&N needs to be specifically selected for the application. Naturaly aspirated filters are different from forced induction filters. If you use a naturally aspirated filter on forced induction it will let shit through. Its all to do with the way the k&n filters work.

It's the same for their 357i induction kits, its a denser filter.


K&N specify this somewhere ? Or even offer this ?

Cant say Ive ever heard of it, or seen anywhere you can specify.

Airflow is airflow, dirt is dirt whether boosted or not. Makes no difference.

The only thing that changes is the volume of air, and that's largely down to power, not method of induction.

Either way, if it's filtration you need, stick with paper or an OEM style filter.

Modern cars even making 200+ run pretty small filters these days. So there really isnt any need for a huge filter. And OEM filters will filter.


I never followed up on this. I know you tend to be skeptical Steve, but I'm only highlighting a fundamental difference, that I to was unaware of until I was enlightened by those of superior and first hand knowledge. Not everything is made equal, you of all people should know that *wink*

K&N said:
A K&N Air Filter is made of 4 to 6 layers of cotton gauze sandwiched between two epoxy-coated aluminum wire screens.

http://www.knfilters.co.uk/filtercharger.aspx

Ergo some have 4 layers, while others have 6, and that is the difference between Turbo,57i kits and N/A filters. In fact I have seen K&N advertise filters with a 2 layer cotton gauze.

Best to find a filter with the densest gauze core when using it in front of a turbo. Or, use a paper filter.

On 26th Oct, 2004 TurboDave16v said:
Is it A-Series only? I think it should be...
So when some joey comes on here about how his 16v turbo vauxhall is great compared to ours, he can be given the 'bird'...


On 26th Oct, 2004 Tom Fenton said:
Yep I agree with TD........


stevieturbo

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TBH if you have the room and need filtration, paper is the only option.

ie if using an ERA airbox, the paper element is more than enough for virtually any A-series.

I've a couple of foam Greddy filters on my turbos..and the turbos are low mounted so in a bad spot for clean air...at least in terms of wet roads.

There is always visible discolouration inside the turbos and boost pipes when I remove them. Like a rusty colour strangely.
I just have no room at all for anything else unless I build a very complicated pipe system for remote mount filters.

K&N's...hit or miss really. I guess they must filter some stuff out, but they really really seem to get loaded with dirt very fast too for some reason.

As for the layering..I dont easily see any mention of this on their site other than it says they use between 4-6 layers. It doesnt seem to say which filters do and why ?

Presumably larger filters may use more, could be for more rigidity or something ? I can't find where it sates why ?

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will


Turbo This..

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Previously josh4444

Australia, brisbane

why are foam (oiled) filters used on dirt bikes that blast around in the dust and dirt?

i was dead agains foam filters but after seeing how well they do on my dirt bike when the whole bike and air box has a layer of dust in the bottom but the other side of the filter is as clean as it was when installed i think foam works when used correctly the only thing is the cleaning that needs to be done really regular

for the road i think goos paopr is the way and the more filter area the better to a point


stevieturbo

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No doubt there are great differences between various brands of foam filter, and I'm sure the more they're oiled the more they will filter.

I just know the Greddy ones I'm using dont seem to filter very well. But they'll definitely be better than nothing or a mesh screen

I had a couple of Ramair filters that would fit too...but they're half the size of the Greddy, and the Greddy are far too tiny.

Problem with most filter tests ( although havent seen any inn recent years ) most tend to be sponsored so results arent always as honest as they could be.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will

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