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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
28th Feb, 2010 at 08:18:13pm
also ive been talking about this car a fair bit and you guys have been a great help so far! so thanks here are a few pics of the car we are talking about, its not a mini but i love it haha and its differnt -
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 1424 Posts Member #: 2810 Formally spanner181187 Dublin, Ireland |
28th Feb, 2010 at 08:22:49pm
Wow, that is a tight engine bay! I expected you would have a lot more room On 12th Nov, 2009 Paul S said:
I think Gary OS has taken over my role as the forum smart arse  On 30th Apr, 2010 Rod S said:
Gary's description is best |
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 12307 Posts Member #: 565 Carlos Fandango Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex |
28th Feb, 2010 at 08:46:12pm
mmm fiat did pack it in, changing the starters is a PITA lol
On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged... Joe, do you have a photo of your tool? http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1 https://joe1977.imgbb.com/ |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
28th Feb, 2010 at 08:58:23pm
this is my problem, space,,,,,honestly its stupid how little there is, it took me months to get the intercooler fitted with the worlds worse route haha |
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12307 Posts Member #: 565 Carlos Fandango Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex |
28th Feb, 2010 at 09:33:24pm
Do you actually need the oil cooler?
On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged... Joe, do you have a photo of your tool? http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1 https://joe1977.imgbb.com/ |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
28th Feb, 2010 at 09:48:29pm
On 28th Feb, 2010 mini13 said:
Do you actually need the oil cooler? a lot of us fund our oils not getting that hot, even with the turbo and the gearbox churning it up, and even if you do, its the easiest thing to find space for elsewhere. I like chucking in random ideas BTW. no i like the ideas!, keep em cumin haha. yes i need the oil cooler, centos run very hot with the turbos and due to everything being so cramped under there any form of cooling is a big help, i have considered shifting the oil cooler to the otherside of the car, thats where is was before the car had an intercooler. thanks jason |
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12307 Posts Member #: 565 Carlos Fandango Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex |
28th Feb, 2010 at 09:49:42pm
are you sure your sure lol how hot does the oil actually get? On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged... Joe, do you have a photo of your tool? http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1 https://joe1977.imgbb.com/ |
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Forum Mod  4828 Posts Member #: 154 Post Whore Midlands |
28th Feb, 2010 at 10:07:07pm
slightly o/t but a chap at the garage i used to get my car mot'd at had a cinq turbo with a 6spd box and nitrous, was supposed to crazy.
Edited by Nick on 28th Feb, 2010. On 20th Oct, 2015 Tom Fenton said:
Well here is the news, you are not welcome here, FUCK OFF. |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
28th Feb, 2010 at 10:12:41pm
On 28th Feb, 2010 Nick said:
slightly o/t but a chap at the garage i used to get my car mot'd at had a cinq turbo with a 6spd box and nitrous, was supposed to crazy. cool looking little car chap :) thanks the 6 speed box is a stright forward swap for the 5 speed, you actually loose top speed but gain acceleration due to lower gearing, i struggle for grip as it is so the 6 speed is a no no haha. Tell me how do mini turbos go on with grip? i run 195/45 14's toyo proxes t1-r's but with all the low end troque its spin up in second on a dry road, sometimes third, and when it wet itll slip in fourth from 3000rpm! jason Edited by 1250cinqturbo on 28th Feb, 2010. |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
28th Feb, 2010 at 10:15:55pm
On 28th Feb, 2010 mini13 said:
are you sure your sure lol how hot does the oil actually get? yes im sure lol, its a commonly talked about subject on the fiat forum with turbo cinqs, i cant say a figure because my oil temp gauge has stopped working and i dont remember the figure but on the high boost cinqs it something everybody adds to there check list. jason |
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12307 Posts Member #: 565 Carlos Fandango Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex |
28th Feb, 2010 at 11:20:57pm
well after reading this...
On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged... Joe, do you have a photo of your tool? http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1 https://joe1977.imgbb.com/ |
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 9258 Posts Member #: 123 Post Whore Betwix Harrogate and York |
1st Mar, 2010 at 07:44:26am
Move the battery to the boot. Fastest 998 mini in the world? 13.05 1/4 mile 106mph
On 2nd Jan, 2013 fastcarl said:
the design shows a distinct lack of imagination, talk about starting off with a clean sheet of paper, then not bothering to fucking draw on it,lol On 20th Apr, 2012 Paul S said:
I'm mainly concerned about swirl in the runners caused by the tangential entry. |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
1st Mar, 2010 at 07:35:41pm
On 28th Feb, 2010 mini13 said:
well after reading this... http://www.fiatforum.com/cinquecento-seice...high-boost.html personally (apart from ehat has already been mentioned about the turbo and intercooler), I wold be looking to put a proper mapable fuel/ignition system on, I dont like the ide of SPI on forced induction, in fact on my project i spent a grand on just a head casting to do just this... you are of course in a much better position to do this, you already have seperate inlet ports, and there is an MPI manifold available, and therefore a loom too, If your already looking at the stronger 16v bottom end then i think it makes sens to go with the 16v head at the same time, then you can change the lobe seperation angle to suit turboing more, plus the 16v head flows like a goodun as i'm sure you know. with an ecu, gt17 and the 16v lump and a bigger intercooler you should be able to crack 200hp without to much greif. you might want to look at the clutch then though lol Here is the problem, the 16v is abit of job to fit due to the little bits and space problems when turbod, it can be done just not on my budjet lol. i could go to the 1242 MPI punto 75 engine but id have to trailer it to the rolling road to have omex management fitted beacause my ecu wount run it, and the punto loom is wrong for the engine bay on a cinq, id have to buy a sie MPI loom just to get me to the rolling road. im a little spoilt for choice but also i dont have time or money to go down the 1.2 16v turbo as yet, i simply need to get the most of my setup running the lower comp pistons and a good head setup, i can run the MPI setup on boost and SPI off boost for a good price but the MPI manifold dosnt like fuel, it pools up in the bottom off the plenum. jason |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
1st Mar, 2010 at 07:43:45pm
also i have spoken with midland turbos, he agrees that the GT1752 will be perfect, he is looking into the differnt turbine housings he can fit to make fitment at my end better
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12307 Posts Member #: 565 Carlos Fandango Burnham-on-Crouch, Essex |
1st Mar, 2010 at 08:01:13pm
that sounds like good news! On 28th Aug, 2011 Kean said:
At the risk of being sigged... Joe, do you have a photo of your tool? http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.p...9064&lastpost=1 https://joe1977.imgbb.com/ |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
1st Mar, 2010 at 09:24:02pm
they where impressed by how poor the T15 was by the way, the turbine wheel was pitted from overheating, the turbine housing was carcked, and the shaft was heat damaged from over reving! shows how unhappy a T15454 is at 1 bar boost!
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4314 Posts Member #: 700 Formerly British Open Classic The West Country |
1st Mar, 2010 at 10:52:21pm
On 28th Feb, 2010 1250cinqturbo said:
Pressure Ratio (14.7+15)/14.7 = 2 P/R CFM = 1.25x6000x85x2 = 225 CFM 225/14.27 = 15.7lb/min Could some one quickly explain the Maths to me? as this is one of the many areas where I am still learning. I'm guessing: pressure ratio = ambient air pressure + boost / ambient air pressure? CFM (cubic feet per minute) = engine size x revs x volumetric efficiency x not sure what the last number is CFM / ambient air pressure = flow rate in pounds? EDIT: I'm getting really confused now as I can't get 1.25x6000x85x2 to make anything like 225. If I leave the phantom 2 out of the equation I get 6375 and if I multiple that by 0.035 to convert from litres to cubic feet I get 223 which is near there. Am I on the right track or have I gone off on a tangent? Edited by Rob H on 1st Mar, 2010. Isambard Kingdom Brunel said:
Nothing is impossible if you are an Engineer |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 01:07:25am
On 1st Mar, 2010 Rob H said:
On 28th Feb, 2010 1250cinqturbo said:
Pressure Ratio (14.7+15)/14.7 = 2 P/R CFM = 1.25x6000x85x2 = 225 CFM 225/14.27 = 15.7lb/min Could some one quickly explain the Maths to me? as this is one of the many areas where I am still learning. I'm guessing: pressure ratio = ambient air pressure + boost / ambient air pressure? CFM (cubic feet per minute) = engine size x revs x volumetric efficiency x not sure what the last number is CFM / ambient air pressure = flow rate in pounds? EDIT: I'm getting really confused now as I can't get 1.25x6000x85x2 to make anything like 225. If I leave the phantom 2 out of the equation I get 6375 and if I multiple that by 0.035 to convert from litres to cubic feet I get 223 which is near there. Am I on the right track or have I gone off on a tangent? my fault missed this out see again - (The phantom 2 was the pressure ratio) 14.7 plus boost divide by 14.7 = P/R (2 in my case) 1.25 x 6000 x 85 x 2p/r divide by 5660 = CFM cfm/ 14.27 - lb/min that better haha. Edited by 1250cinqturbo on 2nd Mar, 2010. |
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1424 Posts Member #: 2810 Formally spanner181187 Dublin, Ireland |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 01:12:04am
Rob, I found Pauls PDF on the subject done all the work for me
On 12th Nov, 2009 Paul S said:
I think Gary OS has taken over my role as the forum smart arse On 30th Apr, 2010 Rod S said:
Gary's description is best |
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4314 Posts Member #: 700 Formerly British Open Classic The West Country |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 07:48:28am
Cheers, I was thinking about it whilst trying to get to sleep last night and pressure ratio seemed to be the most sensible option. Also the fact that you only fill half the chambers each rotation would explain why I was out by a factor of two. I think i'm finally starting to understand the maths after all these years.
Isambard Kingdom Brunel said:
Nothing is impossible if you are an Engineer |
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 8604 Posts Member #: 573 Formerly Axel Podland |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 08:53:38am
I think that equation grossly simplifies the maths involved and does not take account of the air density due to temperature which we know has a major affect on air flow and power.
Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
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520 Posts Member #: 2093 Post Whore Grenoble, France |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 11:03:27am
I did not read the entire thread, sorry if repeat somebody's talk.
std 998 A+, g295, MD266, RHF4, 109hp @0.8bar/5400rpm |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 09:11:59pm
On 2nd Mar, 2010 alpa said:
I did not read the entire thread, sorry if repeat somebody's talk. 1250cinqturbo, did you think about the engine cooling system ? Is it good ? Don't go VNT (especially diesel) route or you'll need an external wastegate to control the stuff. The diesel GT15 were designed to make 110-120hp on a diesel, so it's likely too small for your application. the cooling is acceptable, the rad will be swapping sides soon anyway which helps massivly. I wouldnt go VV no mate, im going for the GT1752 from the saab petrol turbo engines and my GT15 came from a 90bhp diesel, it suffered at 116bhp also. |
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48 Posts Member #: 8432 Member |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 09:15:18pm
On 2nd Mar, 2010 Paul S said:
I think that equation grossly simplifies the maths involved and does not take account of the air density due to temperature which we know has a major affect on air flow and power. However, it does seem to give a reasonable number in this case. yes it does, but im after a rough figure for my requirments only, to do this properly i would have a target BHP figure and work out my engine exact V.E to put into the equation aswell as air density. thanks jason |
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520 Posts Member #: 2093 Post Whore Grenoble, France |
2nd Mar, 2010 at 09:32:06pm
On 2nd Mar, 2010 1250cinqturbo said:
the cooling is acceptable, the rad will be swapping sides soon anyway which helps massivly. I'm not talking about the rad, but the whole system. If you want to extract max power the first thing is to have ALL cylinders at the same temperature. Old engines often have poorly designed cooling path (like on A-series) where water does not flow the same around all cylinders. Try to imagine how all that flows, may be there are some known problems like cyl #4 cams wearing faster that would indicate lack of cooling capacity in this area. std 998 A+, g295, MD266, RHF4, 109hp @0.8bar/5400rpm |
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