Electronic Boost Control
Turbo Mini Forums

Hi,

I'm looking into getting something along the lines of the popular Apexi AVC-R unit. However, after reading through a how-to guide for the installation it appears the unit requires to be patched into injector wires...no good for my carb setup obviously.

Does anyone currently have an electronic boost controller installed?
I would like to think the majority of electronic controllers only require a solenoid valve installing and a simple power feed?...

Apologies for the long-winded question,

Regards, Tim

89' Metro Turbo
157 BHP , 170 lb ft @ 15psi .... So far....
Mikeanics Rolling Road
WINNER OF RETRO CARS SHOW BEST 80's MODIFIED CAR

You really dont need anything as fancy as an apexi item to do the job on our simple cars.

Have a search throught the posts on here, this was dicussed very recently about how to do it with solenoids and mbc's..

hope that helps

Still on a distributor setup, but sounds like a good method mini1071s.

I know that their are cheaper methods of boost control, but price issues aside, the electronic units are very accurate.
Also makes change of boost on-the-go simple.

A Greddy Profec B electronic unit is £180, in comparsion to £150 for a Turbosmart 2 stage MBC unit...So cost wise it would seem silly not to get the jap box?

89' Metro Turbo
157 BHP , 170 lb ft @ 15psi .... So far....
Mikeanics Rolling Road
WINNER OF RETRO CARS SHOW BEST 80's MODIFIED CAR

Mapped ignition is definitely on the to-do list for the car, my thoughts were only that if the likes of Miniwilliams can achieve 200bhp using a distributor, then perhaps it could wait for the future.

The Megasquirt/MJ setup looks relatively straight forward to install, but I would much prefer a 'drive in drive out' installation, for piece of mind and job finish quality.
Also, how many rolling roads (a series turbo familiar) are experienced with fiddling the ignition maps on a MS/MJ setup?

The electronic boost control only came into consideration when looking at the prices compared to the Turbosmart 2 stage MBC unit. These Greddy/Apexi units have impressive claims (stable boost curves, spike protection etc), and it seemed like a good option. Also the display screen gives you all the various boost curves etc etc, which would be reassuring...

P.S Cheers for the thumbs on my car

89' Metro Turbo
157 BHP , 170 lb ft @ 15psi .... So far....
Mikeanics Rolling Road
WINNER OF RETRO CARS SHOW BEST 80's MODIFIED CAR

imo boost controllers are the way forward and not a chav idea. they cut the boost pipe from the turbo to actuator and only allow pressure through when required. this stops the waste gate opening progressivly up to you set pressure.

the idea is that that you get to full boost sooner and can protect against over boost and boost spikes.

also as it does not bleed pressure off the actuator to gain higher boost, you dont waste the pressure, so getting to high boost sooner

well that the idea! i've never tried one so cant coment on the actual difference but as i say the idea seems very good.

What Peter is suggesting is that a MBC (Manual Boost Controller) will do the same job of preventing the wastegate actuator "seeing" boost until a pre-set pressure is achieved.
It does this through use of a spring which allows a ball bearing to lift of it's seat at a set pressure. This pressure is adjustable.
Such a device can be installed under the bonnet or should you desire in the car.
Under the bonnet means shorter pipe runs (limiting boost spike), and less attraction to "play" (up the boost).
Such a controller is far cheaper than an electronic equivalent and does not require electrical inputs.
Peter also mentioned that he has his car rolling road tuned at set boost pressures to ensure all is well.
This is the way forward.
He also mentioned that Management units such as Megasquirt or Megajolt can control boost pressures across a map which again should be set on a rolling road or under scrutiny to ensure optimal running.
We are all open to new ideas and thinking but would like a good banana or curleywurley return per £ spent.
In my opinion an electronic boost controller does not offer a good return rate and that money would be better spent in other areas such as mappable ignition (Megasquirt or Megajolt).
At the end of the day we would hate to see you waste money.

Edited by GTM Turbo on 17th Aug, 2006.

The emerald also can manage boost. it can alter boost depending on which gear you are in or via rpm.

I havent used this yet though.

There are lots of things I could think to spend £180 on that are superior IMO to this box of Japanese "Fast and Furious" trickery......

I tried unsuccesfully to run boost vs rpm with my DTa setup, and hence will be purchassing an Apexi unit for once the injection goes on. These are mappable against RPM aswell - which is what i want to achieve.

For me, it's about holding off transmission damage, clutch capacity, and launching on the track.
I currently have a huge amount of torque at less than 15psi at 3500 rpm, and whilst my clutch is acting as the fuse currently - it won't be with the new setup - hence the transmission has to take this instead.
Being able to map the boost against rpm is a definate bonus in my book - a nice flat torque curve, generated by boost increasing as the torque would otherwise fall away after 4000-odd rpm will certainly make for an easier car to control on ther strip.

Sure - I KNOW that the fastest three at Avon in 2006 didn't have them, but let's put things into another perspective -
Tim's quickest time was 0.4 seconds quicker than my best ever - but some 7mph quicker on trap speed. Respect where it's due for having a very powerfull motor, but that is a bad use of hp for a lightweight car IMO... With a decent boost controller to make a more progressive torque delivery, then the time would be more akin to what I'd expect for the trap speed - ie in the 12's (regularly)....

Edited by turbodave16v on 17th Aug, 2006.

i agree that £180 could be spent on a lot of other things and that there are other ways of doing the same thing. but then again a distributor does the same as an ecu and people here have gone for the ecu (me included) and still dont have the same power as say mini williams.

it reminds me of a sign in a friends workshop. "fast, reliable, cheap. pick any two of the above"

have you seen the emerald setup dave?

It has a purpose built boost vs rpm map. seems just like what the apexi controller can do if not more.

Just a thought for those considering MJ...

DTA also has it boost/RPM Iain...

It used to be PID controlled, and in the latest version switched to plain frequency setup.

Neither worked adequately on a dynamic (acclerating) state - well, enough to the point that I'm going for the Apexi...

the apexi AVC-r is an awesome piece of kit. if you can figure a way to fit a speed sensor it can predict your gearign and then it can set you up with whatever boost you want in whatever gear you are in!.. the injector wire is only used to determine engine speed, this can be wired to an RPM signal source instead, for example, the negative side of your coil.

turbo 16v k-series 11.9@118.9 :)

Denis O'Brien.

eboost is suppost to be better than apexi or greddy

Alex

AlexF

werid!

I'm going on mainly people I know with fast ford's (think 500 bhp cossys and 350 bhp RSTs).

But like you say, it probably depends on the deal you got lol

AlexF

I have fitted and played with alot of AVC-r's and the various greddy efforts. love the AVCR, for ease of use and featureset. never installed or used an eboost before so know nowt about them.

another nice feature on the AVC-r is you can set a startign duty for the solenoid to hit before going to the regulated duty for that boost level(it can self learn this if you are unsure!), so you could have it hit boost nice and soft so you dont break traction, for example.

turbo 16v k-series 11.9@118.9 :)

Denis O'Brien.