Siamese code update
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http://www.emeraldm3d.com/em_projects_Aseries.html

From the UK Injection Tuning God!

If he has trouble with it then theres no hope. Unless Jean can sort the Timing codes, but i dont expect big power engines running five port, port injection

Edited by Sprocket on 6th Feb, 2007.

has anybody actually build a port system that has failed ?or has the theory taken the place of the experimentation and nobody has tried it ?

Medusa + injection = too much torque for the dyno ..https://youtu.be/qg5o0_tJxYM

Getting around the issue with having to run large injectors to flow enough for big bananas which are crappy at idle is easy enough (so long as space is available) and that is run two large ones and two small ones staged ... assuming that Jean's code can handle stagged injection as I know MS2 can do that on 'normal' instals.

As for Dave not getting it coded into his ECU's I can fully understand that. Not only is it a specialised instalation but one that very few people would actually be interested in.

Most classic car people (A and B series engine owners for example) are more than happy to leave the engine alone or apply "period" tunning tweeks. Please remeber I said most!!

I only have to look to my local Mini club for proof of that. When I suggested to one guy that waw asking what was the best standard Mini model to have as a daily driver I stated that I'd go for an injected Copper or a Sportpack as it was refined and had modern driving dynamics and reliability. Instantly I was shot down by most of the memebrship for talking rubbish!!! All the responses said the same thing ..... "it'll break down all the time and cost you hundreds to get fixed .... much better off with points in a dizzy and a carb!"

Now we all know that to be rubbish, look how many of us run MJlj with no problems!!!!

Realistically a 90 BHP A-series Mini is still considered to be quick and a 100+BHP Mini as "special". How many people do you all know that think your a bit mad for trying to put big power through a Mini ... especially with an A-series? How many of you know of big power cars from your clubs that don't really psot into this forum for example?

I know exactly how many turbos are members of my local club (75-80 members, most with two or more cars) ..... ZERO (unless you could the 4 British Open Classic and I are building between us). In my club a 90 BHP 1380 was seen as the "big boy" and the idea of running mapped ignition on a 1430 as "crazzy". The owner of that 1380 regularly points out that she ran it with a standard mechanical fuel pump .... show how hard it was driven for long periods hey!

By the time a company, and that is obviously what Emerald is there to be, a money making company had done the coding, validated the coding on rig, built a demo car, done some development work, rejigged the code, done some more development work, tweeked again and finally did enough varried running to be able to offer help and advice to Jonny from the street as to what cams it could stand, what inejctors to use etc. they will have lost a shed load of money on the handful of systems sold!!!

I don't know if it's that Dave doesn't want to or that he's just being sensible but I don't think the Emerald system, or for that matter any commercial system, will ever really provide for the needs of such a small and specialised market!!!

Basically it's ecconomically non-viable. The only way it will get done is through a tuning community with open-source code and a clever bod at the keyboard.

It needs the community to provide the numerous test vehicles needed for development and building the knowledge base.

It needs the open source code so that people can work on it for their own ammusement and pleasure rather than trying to make it a cost effective solution.

It needs clever bods at the keyboards to provide the inspiration and analyse the results of the work of both the above groups.

I think we have those qualities (not just Turbo Minis bu the whole modern performance Mini scene) and most of all it's for us so we'll keep going till it works!

My what a lot of words for so few full stops!!! LOL

Every day is a school day ...........

How fast and how expensive ...... the same question...

I know of a couple of tunned MPi's that never ran rght at high revs .... as for bespoke instals I am afraid I don't know of any.

It's a good point though. Would need at least dual WBO2 results along with RR printouts to prove / disprove though ....

Every day is a school day ...........

How fast and how expensive ...... the same question...

Hi,
Robert .. I did think about this and posted up on here.

I think the problem revolves around the need for an advance table for injection timing so we can get enough fuel into the engine in the small injection window available. I've dug this out originally from Marcels site




Edit: Although looking at that graph if we could time from the middle of the injection pulse thern we could use fixed timing of 20 BTDC and as the pulse gets longer spread it equally from this point?
I believe that's how Rover did it?
Cheers,
Gavin :)

Edited by Bat on 6th Feb, 2007.

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I know of a couple of tunned MPi's that never ran rght at high revs .... as for bespoke instals I am afraid I don't know of any.

It's a good point though. Would need at least dual WBO2 results along with RR printouts to prove / disprove though ....

Every day is a school day ...........

How fast and how expensive ...... the same question...

This would obviously depend upon what cam was used ...

Every day is a school day ...........

How fast and how expensive ...... the same question...

I wont pretend I follow all this discussion..

But why arent people using a sequential system with 4 injectors, with them pointing towards the valve ( as best as that can physically be achieved )

If using 2 injectors is causing such a headache....why bother ?

Surely 4 large injectors, pointed at the valve, would greatly simplify things ?

As for large ones, the current Siemens 660cc ( 600-660 depending on whos info you read ) are damn good injectors.
I wouldnt be surprised if they would work very well in even a mini.

If they didnt......fire a pair of very small ones at idle etc, one inj per port ( again, no doubt thats very awkward ) and use the 4 biggies proper engine functions.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will

It's not so much the injectors as the air stream.

The forces acting on the charge will pull the fuel with the air regardless of what you try to do with injetor aim.

Every day is a school day ...........

How fast and how expensive ...... the same question...

Looks good

Could not have said it better myself.