Thermostat and radiators
Turbo Mini Forums

As many of you know, I've bought Mark's old car. The trip to Norway went OK apart form SC drops and 500miles on the road.

But, on the road I'm having great troubles getting the car hot enough. I'd like to fit a thermostat, but I'm not sure if they come as 70ish degrees. Which temperatures do you guys run??

If I fit a 70degree thermostat, that will not make the engine run any hotter as the only thing that has changed is a little obstruction in the head.

I also must admit that I'd like to fit a side mounted radiator, but I'm not sure if it's up to the job. I know that Jon and Dave are running these, but as Mark told me, Jon gets a bit hot after a few laps.

Will this be able to cope with 150hp in a Mini?? This is using it along with a small front mounted one of course.

I know that Mark has developed thi package for several years and that I shouldn't start messing with it right away so I'm after opinions firstly.

Edited by Vegard on 23rd Aug, 2004.

I run a side mounted rad, I've always had cooling problems

Team Racing

side rad, no cooling problems but only 120bhp.

alex

AlexF

I think vegard is the problem that your not running a lot of boost at the moment, Mark always run at least 15psi, am I right in thinking your running around 8 psi? Just stick a thermostat in and you'll be fine

Team Racing

86 stat,front rad,

As i understand, you're going to be replacing the front end???
If sou, you are limited for space if you want to keep a std length front and the excellent RSTurbo intercooler...
Ideally - a metro rad would be in there. Don't forget, rads can be 'curved' to suit the front end quite easilly by supporting the core between two blocks at either end and pressing down in the middle...
Failing that, the Front mounted rad/fan combination as fitted to MPi minis is hard to beat - having been provem as capable of cooling even vauxhall 16v engines.
If i were you (i'm not - i'm just saying what i'd do), I'd get the front mounted MPi Rad in there - moving the oil cooler onto one of the inner wings. Admitedly the alternator will have to move, but that's pretty easy - maybe look at gettign one of these modern small units, as found in suzuki swifts...
As regards the intercooler, remove the plastic end cap (the one with the outlet at exactly 90 degrees to the core, rather than the angled one) and make a new end-cap from alloy, with the outlet pointing upwards, or downwards, but basically enough room to clear the dizzy cap, and TIG weld it to the existing core. It's a bit fiddly, but well worth it as this is a great intercooler for it's compact size.
Check these pics for an idea on where to fit the intercooler such that you can still get a standard grill on there (you have to slightly grind the front of the transfer case to make room, and cut the botttom rear return lip off the intercooler, aswell as modify the aperture in the front panel so it is as far up as possible) but it fits a treat.
http://www.manchesterminis.richardswebdesi...ntercooler1.jpg
http://www.manchesterminis.richardswebdesi...ntercooler2.jpg
http://www.manchesterminis.richardswebdesi...ntercooler3.jpg

As regards the thermostat, i use a 74 degree unit, with three 4.5mm holes drilled in it (i don't have the by-pass hose).
Another tip is to connect the cooling system up as normal, but don't connect the outlet from the bottom hose into the head, instead plug it. The outlet from the cyl head (heater tap point) should be connected into the top hose of the rad - even better, if you can connect a small rad in series with it - but not essential.
That should cure any potential issues with cooling...
My last engine block worked fine with the cooling system plumbed up the normal way for the last 5 years, along with the 'minispares super 2 core' rad, but this years engine overheated. Just re-plumbing the cooling system helped significantly.

You got a bargain with Marks car - a well known, proven, mini... If you stick a SC/CR box in there, you'll be pulling consistent low 14 sec 1/4mile runs all day long.

I haven't decided on whether to change the fron, and even if i do, it will be with a Curley F/G one. That leaves planty of room for stuff in the front compared to a steel one. This I'll manage, but thank you for tips Dave.

If I fit a Minispares 2core, AND a heater matrix at the front shouldn't that do the job??
What is most efficient, an oil cooler used as a radiator or a heater matrix? After all, the viscosity of these are quite different.

Should I just chuck a thermostat in? I really cannot see that doing much harm.

Vegard, I have used a cold thermostat, 70 something degree all the time. I have the same one fitted to Minor as well. I don´t have the bypass hose between the head and water pump, instead I have drilled the thermostat like Dave to allow some by-pass.

I have the car off the road for respray preparation (down to bare shell) and also think about fitting a BIG intercooler in the fron and moving the radiator back to std position.

I am a bit sceptic about cooling. Does the 2-core unit really work with high boost ? Also, which fan are you using ?

Jukka

Hi Jukka, yes to that mate.
Mind you it does depend on what you call high boost. But I use a 2 core rad and an little heater matrix. with a 74 thermostat with NO holes in it, as it warms up much better that way. And I don't feel you need it if you have the take off the head open all the time. (been running like this for ages now so it does work.)

Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on a carb?
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on Injection?

http://www.mattwoodsphotography.com

I take the head off every 5 years. I am running a 1380 engine at 15 psi.

what you mean Jukka?

Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on a carb?
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on Injection?

http://www.mattwoodsphotography.com

i do the same as willie, dont put holes in thermostat as the engines will take longer to heat up as long as there is curculation round the head and block via the heater tap it will be fine.

you will do more damage to the engine if it takes longer to heat up, i run a 74 deg stat and i recon it takes half the time to heat as with 4 holes in it especially as we are getting colder mornings and evenings now.

ps i run a 3 core with a heater matrix and every thing is fine , i used a 2 core for ages and when i had to run a 3 core because the 2 core fell apart, i found out the 3 core was a lot better, most people with 3 core rads usauly swap them because they are only blocked .
spoke to a rad company and showed the 2 different rads and said the 3 core had better cooloing than the 2 because of the fin contacts to the cores were much hicher than the 2 core and i would agree with that.

the fins rap right around the cores unlike the 2 core which is just consintinaerd along side.
thus given better heat dipersal.

always looking for them bigger bunches of bannanas

No I do the same as The Hogmister! as you told me and i thought what a good idea!:)

Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on a carb?
First 5 port miniturbo to make over 200 bhp on Injection?

http://www.mattwoodsphotography.com

Just to let you know, we had made the 2 core made with 21 tubes and D type finning not 19 tubes and B type fining as others have. More expensive to make but far superior in cooling terms. The o/e rad under grd110 pt number is a great rad as fitted as standard to the later Mini 30's these are the 3 core as you mention with D type finning. Ian

http://www.avonbar.com

Miniwilliams,

I have had a 1380 engine with turbo since 1995/96, first at 7 psi to dial everything in, then 10 psi for a couple of summers and now 15 psi for the past 2 years. I took the engine apart in winter 1999/2000 and have not touched it since that. No blown gaskets, same helical box and drops for a total of 34000 miles. This winter the car will be resprayed (the wife wants the car red...) so the engine will come out. Maybe I´ll check the internals.

Jukka

hi jukka

that sounds great if you havnt had any head gasket probs, as that was the one thing ive been worried about when i do my 1380.

what head gasket do you use i use a tam 1521 do you recon that will do the job, i recon i will run 10 psi or may be 12 psi tops.

ive got the head to do as yet but was wondering on what valve sizes do you use and have you got large ports or are they just cleaned up.

always looking for them bigger bunches of bannanas

I use the silver TAM1521 with ARP hardware. I torqued the head to 50 lbft and did not retorque afterwards. I have 36 mm intakes and 31 mm exhaust valves that have been offset. The ports are modifies, most of the guide bosses are removed. The ports are not that big, I tend to be conservative with porting. I suppose there is still something gained if going to larger ports.

Has anyone used a 4 core rad with a turbo motor? That was my plan for the main reason that I have a brand new 4 core, the thinking being that the extra water capacity would help?