wheels ?
Turbo Mini Forums

at the mo im running 7x13 deep dish superlights. me minis off the road for winter while major works getting done to it and im faced with a dilemma do i stick with me superlights or go to 10's. the problem ive got with the 7x13's is that doesnt go in a straight line on acceleration. are 10's better? and has any one ever got there turbo to go in a straightish line with deepdish 13's.
i really like the look of the superlights and dont wanna change them if 10's are gonna be no better. and eventually one day i might have more power and worried it will be undrivable with the suerlights on

no longer a series, but still 1.3 turbo.

have you gotta jack knight 'equal driveshaft arrangement'?

A friend of mine was telling me how good it was the other nite and what a difference it makes.

Cheers, Stevo

Have a look at the ERA turbo site : http://www.eraturbo.com
Go to "The ERA Story" and read the "when ERA Met Rover " and the section above: -

I quote "Specially made lower front suspension arms provide the necessary 1.5 degrees of negative camber which, combined with increased front wheel toe-out, minimises torque steer; a common problem with powerful front wheel drive cars. New adjustable damper units and bump stops are fitted all round and the car is lowered."

If you arent already, adjustable camber front arms +tie rods are a must when trying to make a tubo mini go in a straight line without spending bags of cash, especially with big wheels.

Hope this helps.

I don't think you'll ever get rid of torque steer with a turbo motor. However, torque steer does get worse the wider (or bigger off-set) your wheels have. So, if you were going to get some 10s that had the same off-set as your 13s I would assume it wouldn't be much better (assume is very important in that sentance).

I think well set-up suspension (equal caster etc.) will always be a help though.

You don't live to far from me I think. I've got most of the gear to measure suspension angles, so give us a shout in the new year and I might be able to do you a quick set-up.

Wil

Fastest 998 mini in the world? 13.05 1/4 mile 106mph

I'm still not convinced by the 'equal length drive shaft' kits...

The maths just doesn't equate when the shafts are so short, relativly little difference in length, and not running through silly angles.
As Wil says, offset is the biggest generator of torque-steer 'feel'. Bear in mind, that in an ideal situation, the king pin inclination (a straight line drawn between the pivots of the top and bottom ball joints) should fall in the centre of the tyre footprint on the ground.
13's make this situation slightly worse by having a stiffer sidewall - less forgiving than a 10" tyre with a similar offset.

If you want to try the theory out, find a pair of stock 12" mini steel rims (145/165 it don't matter) and bolt them up the front of your car then take it for a razz up the road.

That said, if Wil and Ben can get their racer to handle well on 13" starmags, any offers of a geometry check should be jumped at!

cheers for the reply guys
wil- cheers for the offer but ive got as much use of a full wheeel aligner at work as i need, might need some advise on settings in the new year though
TD- good idea, ive even got some stock 12s in the loft, wish id thought of that before i got giddy with the angle grinder and chopped me front end off, took me windows out, stripped the inside etc DO'H

dont need to decide untill i come to fit me front end so ive got a couple of months to ponder over it. think the 13s will win though

no longer a series, but still 1.3 turbo.

I tried every thing to get rid of torque steer on my mini wtih 13's, I had no LSD then, I have now changed to 10's with and LSD and it's buch better, even though the LSD should make it worse

Team Racing

Speaking from experience (for a change), I have gradually developed my suspension and have tried a lot of settings. From hydrolastic, right the way through to a race setup, using lots of different wheel/tyre combinations.

The way I see it is this.

Imagine the roll axis of the car, like a skewer through the car, from front to back. As you are driving, the car moves around this point, transferring load to various wheels, according to what the car is up to.

Lowering and stiffening this axis is the best recipe for decent handling, sadly, one way of doing this causes torque steer to be exhibited quite seriously.

So, how does torque steer work? As the car accellerates, it's weight is transferred to the back wheels (along a centre axis), the front wheels being light lose a certain amount of grip. Any discrepancy in wheel downforce will be exhibited as quite a difference in grip. This will cause one wheel to grip and the other one not to. If there is a large KPO (see Daves description), this causes the steering to kick when one wheel grips. The tyre contact patch distorts, if you have them, tie rod rubbers stretch, pushes steering arm out a squillionth of a mm and the car veers off sideways, as it does this, the weight transfer of the car is directed to the wheel which is gripping. So with loads of power, the effect is very marked indeed. So with a bit of power (like my car) the car weaves under accelleration, with more power, I expect/hear it would veer off sideways at a much more exciting angle.

Lowering the roll centre minimises this, but NOT by increasing the track. Having less stiff suspension/tyres (according to my results) seems to make the effect less marked. Basically, it is a characteristic of FWD cars with a bit of KPO and lots of power. Having equal length driveshafts, I suppose would tend to create a more equal balance between the wheels and even though this is a very minor thing, it may stop the chain of events which lead to 'swapping lanes' torque steer. They obviously make them for a reason and from what I can gather, my car goes right under accelleration. This has to be down to the driveshafts (as my weight should weight the OS/F tyre more weighty/gripping but from what I can see, the left one grips more (has more torque).

Probably a load of bollocks as usual, but that's how I see it.

stu

Bugger off, I'm getting there.

i still like my 8*13 alleycats though!

Get some 10's

Mambas are very light for cheap wheels!

i think ill go for 10's to be honest need some brakes though and i was thinking bout the mambas i seen some mint ones at shows last year and was gonna buy them but didnt gutted now.

no longer a series, but still 1.3 turbo.