Power for a given boost on k1100 heads
Turbo Mini Forums

I have been attempting to try to find out what sort of power k1100 Turbo minis are producing for a given boost in order to help decide what the best turbo option for my car will be.

Now I know there are many factors such as porting, cams and the turbo used but as a rough guide I would be interested to find out what power is being produced at say 10, 15 and 20 psi. I realise some of you clever people have probably run various senarios through simulators and wondered what the number predictions had come out at.

I am essentially hoping that 12-13psi will net me 190-200bhp via the faithful gt17 while still allowing free revving to 8000rpm. What I have establised is that the gt17 is getting puffed out at 15psi after about 5500rpm. though there may have been some other factors at work in that case, it seems feasable.


Thanks

James

It seems alot of people are opting for the gr2056 now and maybe one or two for the? gt22, as paul s said the gt 17 wouldnt give enough power for his application but otheres have seen 200+

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-Ford S-max Mk2 Ecoboost
-Rover 100 VVC #2 - track project

Searching is all you need on TurboMinis

What I thought I said was that although some have seen over 200hp from the Gt17, if your target is over 200hp, then there are better turbos such as the Gt2056 or the TD04-13t.

What my latest simulations (just playing) have shown is that the Gt2056 limit of 260hp quoted by Garrett is about right.

Above 260, then you could be looking at a Gt28 or something that will flow up to 35 lb/min.

Edited by Paul S on 20th Sep, 2011.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Right after a search of various threads I have found this, so here is some useful info from turbo harry about his hybrid gt2056.

On 27th Mar, 2010 TurboHarry said:
I was on an old Bosch dyno to optimize ignition....it made 225hp at the crank at 1 bar boost at 7800rpm (LT inlet, RS exhaust cam), the max I ran on the street was 1,2 bar.
The compressor map of the GT 2056 is very broad and effective - I took the CHRA and turbine from a Mercedes (V-band) and fitted the bigger 56 compressor from another turbo....IIRR it was from an Alfa, but no sure anymore?

If I could join the RR sessions in England easily I would run for sure more boost...)

http://www.minifreunde.at/harry/links/turbo.htm

305hp at 8k, 22psi Gt28 based, engine dyno proven not predicted

Jk

If Carling made Mini engines
it would probably be like this one!

Its all down to what you want from the engine in the first instance.

Me personally i'm building the engine for 180hp target at 15psi boost. That'll be with LT inlet and exhaust cams with a retarded cam timing, keeping the red line a bit lower, standard un ported head, 9:1 compression ratio, GT1752 and a fairly heavy RTS verto clutch to cope with the torque. This is should also acheive a smooth 850rpm idle, and MOT cat test emissions.

If you build the bottom end for high revs, you could easily run the RS cams with a GT2056 turbo and reach for 250hp at 15 to 20psi boost dependant on what you finally decide to rev it to. Compression ratio and cam timing being other factors to consider. You will loose the 'road car' idle and have to be content with Baisic MOT emissions test, wich is by no means a major issue for most anyway.

Here are some of Roberts excelent graphs from the dyno shoot out back in 2009 (has it been that long!!) Power and torque at the hubs, not the wheel, nor the flywheel (basically no tyre drag)

Edited by Sprocket on 21st Sep, 2011.

Good stuff sprocket, your engine spec is more or less exactly what I was planning even with the same compression ratio. You will just have to get it finished and get some numbers for it as that will confirm whether the gt17 will supply the air required.

I am not looking to build a powerful engine, but would like between 190-210 bhp to make going 16v worth the effort. More specifically I don't want it going flat after 6k, but pulling hard up to 8k, basically the whole excercise is about trying to build a nice track engine. If a small turbo can be used but still retain the power and revs then mission accomplished. Its about trying to select the correct turbo for the application, as I have a gt17 and a subaru td04 sat on the shelf.

hi moley ,
im running a gt17 1312cc ,,and have good power to 7k ,on 16 psi i had 190 bhp odd .

on 21 psi ,at 5600 i had 230 at the wheels .it had never run at over 20 psi over the full rev range , on the smart dyno it had 193 bhp @wheels , on 17 psi ,at 6500..

there could be two reasons for the boost dropping so much from 21 to 17 ,one is that the run was so fast the boost spiked then dropped to where it was set ..the second is that the turbo is getting past its flow capacity .

when drag racing it has held 19.6 psi to the red line ,7k ,with no problem ,and run a terminal of 112 mph ,suggesting it top end is still working .althuogh i am crossing the line at only 6k ish .

interestingly ,my boost and mph were comparable eg

14 psi 106 mph
16 psi 109 mph
19 psi 112 mph ,

this suggests the power increase per psi of boost is actually getting bigger as the boost goes up .since the air drag is increasing too.


looking at these links


http://en.bsr.se/products/tuning-kits/saab/9-3/2.0t/


http://www.abbottracing.net/product.php?id_product=343


http://www.maptun.com/tuningGuide.php?kate...qoqoqb8a32c2c60


http://www.maptun.se/tuningGraph.php?kateg...0&maximumNm=600


you can see theere is a range from 240 to 270 odd for power quotations , i have in the past seen a couple more in the 265 range ,but cant find them now .

my feeling is that it will make power up to around 250 to 260 bhp ,but that a bigger turbo like the ones id advised for other engines more race oriented would make around 10 to 20 bhp more at the same boost above 230 bhp ish .presuming the rest of the design is optimised .

id estimate the gt17 to flow around 10% less air than the gt2056 ,for which there is a map around somewhere . but id estimate its turbine to flow more efficiently in the mid range ,then choke a bit at the top end due to its small id.

regards
robert

Medusa + injection = too much torque for the dyno ..https://youtu.be/qg5o0_tJxYM

I'd be more tempted to compare the GT1752 with a GT2052 50 trim, since it uses a simiar wheel. The only real difference then is the A/R and the smaller turbine which should see it boost earier than the GT20?