Superchargeing
Turbo Mini Forums

Hi all, has any one looked in to supercharging, i know that the kit from mini speed is massively expenivce but alot of superchargers from them New fake minis are comming on ebay, tho it brings a chill to putting some of its parts in to my mini, its still a supercharger, wondering if any one has any other ideas of what supercharger are out there or how to fit them. thanks
Alex1340

The Bini s has a Eaton supercharge which is much cheaper than the minispeed one... the difference is that the eaton is a twin screw roots type, where as the otehr one is a Lycomsh (spelling) which is much much more efficent but harder (read more expensive) to make.

Its not hard to supercharge... use the metro turbo parts and work out a drive for the supercharger and away you go!

Alex

AlexF

I reckon the Eaton is the best supercharger out there, and i'm not just being biased!

I've got an M45 from a Bini heading my way VERY soon. I'm going to look at this for fitting, and maybe put together a kit, or plans for such, depending on how much of a job it looks like!

FYI the M45 on a 1293 engine will make the following boost when suitably geared whilst remeining in the maximum efficiency band.
6500RPM: 11.5psi
7000RPM: 10.1psi

It can be overspeeded reliably up to 14000 rpm, but efficientcy does drop, so i'd recomend aiming for 6500RPM as your gearchange point, and slightly overspeeding as you shift up.

As Alex says, blow through a standard turbo carb. As with a turbo an intercooler will be beneficial, as compressing air always heats it...
Somethign to consider if you want economy under cruise however - you need to add a bypass, or you'll be pushing out 11psi (and having to fuel it) even under light cruise at 4000rpm

Hi dave if you do end up putting the M45 on you'r engine, i would love to come and see how you have done it, its going to be awile tile i get a engine built to go in the pickup i don't have yet, which will need a full rebuild and customizing. so let me know how you get one.
thanks
Alex

your just bais!!

Its not the most effiecent, so how can it be the best?

But I must admit I'd use one... but I don't want to spend power turning a supercharge, when a turbo will do it virtually for free!

alex

AlexF

Do it for free?
Never understood this claim fully...

Try putting a restrictor in the exhaust of a 150hp nat asp engine that is a 20 degree included angle cone with a 20mm or so diameter hole at the end, that all the gasses have to escape through and see how much the power drops by...
Never done it, but would like to just to see what the power loss is...

That is in no way 'free power'

yeah, maybe i am biased about the Eaton, but as i don't see any OEMs using the Centrifugal, Lyspholm (spelling LOL), Vane or the many other slightly different types, you can't claim it is far from ideal.
The charge pulsing that all blowers except the centrifugal and Helix'd screw (eaton) is not what a siamesed head wants to experience - you can't deny that...

D

the eaton supercharge has like a squareish output so it just needs a adapter plate to hook up to a intercooler, then in to the carb as with a Turbo engine with a intercooler, then just have find a place to put the supercharger and how to drive it, that seems like the hard part to me.

Alex

I agree with AlexF2003

Supercharging is all well and good but it takes a considerable amount of HP to turn a belt driven supercharger as opposed to a turbo which does not rob any HP from the engine. Its nice having boost from idle but is it really worth that added stress on the engine?

There was a figure that was published a while back that some of the larger Roots style blowers require almost 40 HP to turn at full boost.

I work on turbo diesel engines all night long and when a turbo locks up, the engine still runs well but does not make the power it should due to lack of boost obviously. There is a considerable compression difference from a turbo diesel and a mini but the restriction from a turbo is no more than that of a catalytic converter or twin box exhaust!

-james

Edited by NYAuthi on 13th Feb, 2004.

-james

Fair play for telling us of your experiences James, but on similar lines, when i had a T2 seize on me (2 days before Avon Park 2002!!! LOL!!!) it wouldn't rev over 5000 rpm, and was slower than a stock 1275.

Overspeeding a supercharger causes HUGE power losses, as can be seen by the graps available for the Eatons - the losses are proportional to boost until a certain speed is reached, then they rise significantly...

I totally rate turbos as the pure power makers, but ultimately, whilst a turbo is spooling up, a supercharger is already making huge boost... I've never worked on a well modified supercharged vehicle admittedly, but there is a huge untapped potential for the A-series from these many Bini Blowers appearing on the market...

Well I have never calculated the exhaust restirctions.. but its still likely to be less than the blowers drain IMO...

But I agree "there is a huge untapped potential for the A-series from these many Bini Blowers appearing on the market... " :cool:

Alex

AlexF

Points well taken Dave but the key reason for lack of power and revs when your turbo locked is due to the low compression ratio of the motor naturally aspirated. If you had a high compression turbo motor the you would feel a great power loss but the car would not fall on its face as your mini did, unforunatley 2 days before Avon Park!

The reason superchargers are so popular is because, unlike a turbo, they are a bolt and go setup. There are really not too many modifications that need to be made to screw on a supercharger. They also do not require the attention a turbo does due there lack or heat production (compared to a turbo) and the fact that most of them are self contained units carrying there own lubrication.

I work in the race car world and most everyone is trading in blowers for twin turbos. In the mini world it seems that everyone may be trading there turbos for superchargers!!!
Check out our website www.miperformance.com

I think that supercharging a mini, especially with a newer style blower, is a pretty trick thing to due but I wouldnt trade a turbo for one! I hope i'm not offending anyone here, just expressing my opinion.

-james

-james

It?s a swedish desing called Lysholm you guys are trying to spell out.

Whatever, I am surprised to see how cheap the Bini superchargers seem to sell at ebay. E.g. compared to what a new turbo costs. Well, don?t really know if these "delivery mileage only" really sell or is there a skyhigh reserve. My mate works at Jaguar over here and he could get a XKR big Eaton for quite a bit cheaper than list price. Bini charger sounds nice but I?d need an engine to fit it into...