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Forum Mod  5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 07:12:05pm
Ive just reverted back to a timing chain from a belt. As we know, new chains stretch 2 degrees but how long or how many miles do you reckon it takes?
Edited by paul wiginton on 2nd Jul, 2008. I seriously doubt it! |
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Forum Mod 10980 Posts Member #: 17 ***16*** SouthPark, Colorado |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 07:58:01pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 paul wiginton said:
As we know, new chains stretch 2 degrees Paul I don't know this? Who did the testing? On 17th Nov, 2014 Tom Fenton said:
Sorry to say My Herpes are no better Ready to feel Ancient ??? This is 26 years old as of 2022 https://youtu.be/YQQokcoOzeY |
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 5329 Posts Member #: 140 Proven 200+bhp & Avon Park 05,06,07 Class D 3rd place |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:07:49pm
is that a fact paul?? have you like dave say, tested them? as it's not what i have found. Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
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 4559 Posts Member #: 786 Post Whore Bermingum |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:18:07pm
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:20:29pm
Its a general rule of thumb, I always used to time my cam at 104 so it would stretch to 106, checking the timing later on it had stretched 2 degrees every time.
Edited by paul wiginton on 2nd Jul, 2008. I seriously doubt it! |
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:25:03pm
I have just sent an email to Swifty to verify this, Ill let you know what he said tomorrow.
I seriously doubt it! |
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 6965 Posts Member #: 507 Fastest A Series Mini in the World leeds/wakefield. |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:25:04pm
if you really want to find out how much a chain stretches over a given hrs run time , you will have to fizically measure it with a in either mm or inches.then using the cercumference of the cam gear work it out properly,
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 4360 Posts Member #: 1459 En-suite user Braintree, Essex |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:30:30pm
In a idea world, should you change the sprockets also if you change the chain? Same as on a bike? On 19th Jan, 2010 wil_h said:
I would start the furthest place from the finish. On 24th Mar, 2012 apbellamy said:
I feel all special knowing that I've given your mum my wood. Been neglecting Turbo'd 'A' series.............. |
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5329 Posts Member #: 140 Proven 200+bhp & Avon Park 05,06,07 Class D 3rd place |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:32:56pm
well i've never found them to stretch, do you use a cheap chain mate?? Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:34:52pm
No, only Swiftys
I seriously doubt it! |
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6965 Posts Member #: 507 Fastest A Series Mini in the World leeds/wakefield. |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:41:53pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 paul wiginton said:
No, only Swiftys Paul lol, does that make a difference then, carl |
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:45:19pm
Well his engines seem to do very very well most Mini race series so I dont doubt they are gonna be good parts.
I seriously doubt it! |
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4360 Posts Member #: 1459 En-suite user Braintree, Essex |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:46:51pm
Always thought they lasted pretty much the life of the car. Surely a duplex would last alot longer unless I'm mistaken. Edited by Jason G on 2nd Jul, 2008. On 19th Jan, 2010 wil_h said:
I would start the furthest place from the finish. On 24th Mar, 2012 apbellamy said:
I feel all special knowing that I've given your mum my wood. Been neglecting Turbo'd 'A' series.............. |
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5329 Posts Member #: 140 Proven 200+bhp & Avon Park 05,06,07 Class D 3rd place |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:48:22pm
I've have heard of it Paul yes, that doesn't make it right though Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:49:28pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 milamber said:
Always thought they lasted pretty much the life of the car. Surely a duplex would last twice as long unless I'm mistaken. Dont know to be honest, Ive always thought of chains as consumable along with shells, rings, oil pumps..... Paul I seriously doubt it! |
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4360 Posts Member #: 1459 En-suite user Braintree, Essex |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 08:50:49pm
I can understand race conditions cocking them up, harsh acceleration etc On 19th Jan, 2010 wil_h said:
I would start the furthest place from the finish. On 24th Mar, 2012 apbellamy said:
I feel all special knowing that I've given your mum my wood. Been neglecting Turbo'd 'A' series.............. |
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Site Admin  15300 Posts Member #: 337 Fearless Tom Fenton, Avon Park 2007 & 2008 class D winner & TM legend. |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:05:13pm
Why not use one of the Kent high-velocity chains, rumoured not to stretch, and I can believe that too from the construction.
On 29th Nov, 2016 madmk1 said:
On 28th Nov, 2016 Rob Gavin said:
I refuse to pay for anything else Like fuel 😂😂 |
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6965 Posts Member #: 507 Fastest A Series Mini in the World leeds/wakefield. |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:14:18pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 paul wiginton said:
Well his engines seem to do very very well most Mini race series so I dont doubt they are gonna be good parts. Seriously, has no-one heard of this before? Paul Paul i am the eternal sceptic, i beleive nothing i'm told without good evidence, forget how well swiftune egines perform in there relative arena's , not all A series timing chains are the same , but i,'ll wager most are, and finding one type that is far superior to the rest is not garanteed to come from a succesfull engine builder just because his engines perform well, any tining chains in any race engine are replaced [as you say] well before any serious stretching takes place, why do theya change them i here you ask, because in the past they have been shown to stretch slightly if used over and over, as i said above , buy two , measure them [ record the finding] then use one in your engine, when rebuild time comes measure the used on , see if theres any differrence over the miles covered, carl |
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5329 Posts Member #: 140 Proven 200+bhp & Avon Park 05,06,07 Class D 3rd place |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:16:19pm
Paul, in my engine i can have the cam timed in at say 114 or 104 degrees it make no odds. know people won't believe me saying that but it's what i've found, so a 2 degree stretch wouldn't do much! IMO Best 1/4 mile 13.2 seconds @116 mph
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 7765 Posts Member #: 74 I pick holes in everything.. Chief ancient post excavator |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:21:21pm
O fcourse a new chain will stretch when worn. Basic physics really. On 13th Jul, 2012 Ben H said:
Mine gets in the way a bit, but only when it is up. If it is down it does not cause a problem. |
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6965 Posts Member #: 507 Fastest A Series Mini in the World leeds/wakefield. |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:26:44pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 Vegard said:
O fcourse a new chain will stretch when worn. Basic physics really. this is true, but who's to say it will wear, when its used, we are assuming because they are used they are stretching, i would have thought they would stretch far more when warm than they ever would when worn /used, now that is a basic law of physics, so i'd be tempted not to worry too uch myself, carl |
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1425 Posts Member #: 690 Post Whore Norfolk |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:29:37pm
If you are using a tensioner I'd go straight to the timing you intend to run - for the miles you do with the engine - especially before Avon now! it'll not stretch - is it a duplex with a tensioner?
If Carling made Mini engines
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:29:47pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 fastcarl said:
On 2nd Jul, 2008 paul wiginton said:
Well his engines seem to do very very well most Mini race series so I dont doubt they are gonna be good parts. Seriously, has no-one heard of this before? Paul Paul i am the eternal sceptic, i beleive nothing i'm told without good evidence, forget how well swiftune egines perform in there relative arena's , not all A series timing chains are the same , but i,'ll wager most are, and finding one type that is far superior to the rest is not garanteed to come from a succesfull engine builder just because his engines perform well, any tining chains in any race engine are replaced [as you say] well before any serious stretching takes place, why do theya change them i here you ask, because in the past they have been shown to stretch slightly if used over and over, as i said above , buy two , measure them [ record the finding] then use one in your engine, when rebuild time comes measure the used on , see if theres any differrence over the miles covered, carl I have the evidence Carl, after rebuilding the engine countless times (with my cam timed at 104) I always recheck it after a few hundred miles of running in under 7,000 rpm. It has always stretched perfectly to 106 every time without fail. This year however I dont have time to do a few hundred miles so was wondering how few miles I can get away with. Swifty told me "Always time the cam 2 degrees before what you want it to finally be. " This is because it will stretch before you have finished running it in so it is spot on when it goes on the rolling road. He is the one to know as he runs in dozens of engines on his dyno then sets them up and does power readings at 1 degree intervals just before and after 106 (if its a Kent cam). He has even done this on my engine in the past, so its quite irrefutable really coming from 3 different sources atleast including Gavin. Paul I seriously doubt it! |
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Forum Mod 5933 Posts Member #: 784 9 times Avon Park Class C winner Milton Keynes |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:32:30pm
On 2nd Jul, 2008 johnK said:
If you are using a tensioner I'd go straight to the timing you intend to run - for the miles you do with the engine - especially before Avon now! it'll not stretch - is it a duplex with a tensioner? as Matt says the grinding on the cam will differ more than that from cylinder to cylinder down its length! fit it - time it - try to beat Gav! Why use a tensioner? Duplex dont need it, Ive never had one Paul I seriously doubt it! |
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 6274 Posts Member #: 509 Post Whore Isle of Man |
2nd Jul, 2008 at 09:32:59pm
when i bought my engine kit off morson he advised the same "Turbo's make torque, and torque makes fun"
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