Coil on Plug options
Turbo Mini Forums

Now that we can have coil-on-plug using Jeans add-on board, i've been considering option for coil-on-plug on a 5 port.

The problem with most COP coils is that they are designed for a twin cam head and are very long. So long that they may even hit the bonnet. Also vibration may be a problem due to the unsupported length.

I've been looking at Coil-Near-Plug systems such as the LS2 coils:

http://www.megamanual.com/seq/coils.htm#ls2

Anyone had any experience with this type of coil?

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

I have been reccomended these many times by folks stateside, to the point I bought a set of LSx units - but sold them when I needed some cash LOL! (but I did sell them for 3x more than I paid, and more than the 'going rate' so not too bad a deal!

I believe StevieTurbo has personal experience of them (he might have also been one of the folks who reccomended them to me?

Edited by TurboDave16V on 9th Mar, 2009.

I've just found some new ones on Ebay US for $240 for eight.

Is that the right sort of price?

Tempted.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

It seems to be a mixed opinion on which is 'better' - as in LS1 or LS2 - but I can't help but feel if you buy a set, you've got four spare so it doesn't really matter. LS2+ stuff should be easier to source as the motors weren't quite as scarce. You need to price up the connectors as well though...

On a 4 cylinder engine that won't be doing astronomical RPM, is there really much benefit over coilpack ?

The increased available dwell/spark time shouldn't actually be required, there are plenty of 4 cylinder turbos that happily run a single coil through a dizzy cap - obviously the LT side is electronic through the EMS but it's still a single coil and mechanical distribution - and can still generate enough spark voltage for high boost levels.

So I'm intrigued as to where you see the benefit.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

I know EVO was having problems ages ago with coil packs - maybe it was him who put me onto the LSx stuff...
Damn this getting older and memory poorer lark. :(

Blieve it or not Dave your Memory is still perfect is your recall system thats Fucked

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

That was from the factors, a Motorcraft part though.

http://trigger-wheels.com/store/index1.html
Tom is spot on £45

Also the coil on plugs not terribly reliable - just ask VAG who had cars off the road in bulk a few years back!

On 5th Sep, 2011 Vegard said:
I stand corrected. You should know

I have to say I've personally come across or heard of far more problems with standalone coils than I have with coilpacks. As Nick says VAG coils are prone to fail, as are Peugeot/Citroen/Renault ones. Henry Fords mob use a coilpack.

turbo 16v k-series 11.9@118.9 :)

Denis O'Brien.

Kawasaki or Suzuki Denso coils.

I use the 129700-4150 coils with 1.5ms dwell and have run them with 1ms dwell up to 8k rpm without issue.

I initialy used a very short coil, but had problems with those blowing fuses with a dwell of 1ms. Thinking about it now I recon a dwell 0f 0.5ms would have probably been more apropriate for those, but I just wanted to get the engine running and set up without the fannying around. I am going to try them again.

I think the reliablity issue of them is subjective. You only really hear about the ones that fail, but never the ones that dont. Coil packs also fail. COP coils are prone to abuse on aftermarket ECU's and fail more rapidly if they are set up incorrectly, you cannot simply double up the coils on one ignition driver, as the Back EMF's do wierd things with them. Apparently, well that is what I have been told. One coil per driver One thing to consider with COP is that if one coil fails, you loose one cylinder, where as if one coil fails on a coil pack you loose two cylinders

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Suzuki-GSX-R600-K2-I...%3A1|240%3A1318

Those coils aren't exactly compact are they?

So what are you going to do Paul? A brand-new EDIS?

How compact do you want them to be Dave?

The coils pictured are about 15mm longer than the ones I was having problems with

Edited by Sprocket on 10th Mar, 2009.

That's ok with a twin cam head but with a 5 port head they would be out there. And I don't know how you'd keep them secured.

Jean

http://www.jbperf.com/

Thanks for the help guys.

I think that all the COP options will break plugs. The plugs are not designed to carry the weight of a coil unsupported.

My preferred option is the LS2 coils. Jean has informed me that they do not need the IGBT driver in the ECU as they work off the ECU logic circuit.

The LS2 coils work out at £30 each. Plus some connectors.

Cheaper would be the new EDIS coil pack, but that's a bit boring.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Well, I've bought some LS2 type coils.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAP...em=180334507680

See how they go.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."

Hi,
You're right in that they do need some support.



Cheers,
Gavin :)

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My Mini build diary

LS1/2 coils are very powerful, and have been proven in many V8 1000bhp+ builds, and smaller 4 cyl turbo, big boost, methanol etc...
Haltech even re-sell these as their own high power coils.

best to buy em as a complete take off with leads/wiring from a used car if possible. Saves any hassle sourcing parts.

I have some coil lead terminations if needed ( MSD sell them to sut 8.5mm leads )

Although I think Some Astra, Citroen and Pug leads use the same fitment as these coils.

Although any typical modern 4 tower coil would probably porovide enough spark, and be cheaper.

97/98 Subaru coilpacks are very good, although require an ignitor.
The LS coils have a built in ignitor.

9.85 @ 145mph
202mph standing mile
speed didn't kill me, but taxation probably will