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Home > For Sale > 5 Port EFI Kits - Gauging Interest

Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

I'm about to start on another EFi project and need to put together a load of parts.

Whilst I am at it, I thought it may be worthwhile making a kit of parts available. Most of it will be bought in except the inlet manifold and some other odds and ends.

This will utilise the Megasquirt ECU including the TM developed Siamese Code options.

It will not be cheap - £2k plus I would think, but what you will get will be proven and have a base setup which with a little tweaking should be ready to go. Help with the final setup would be available.

The sort of contents of the kit would be as follows:

Main Hardware:
ECU - MSII with two injector outputs, two coil outputs, cam sensor and dual O2 sensor input. Numerous add-on extras available.
Throttle Body/Bodies - Dual Jenvey for NA or single for charged version.
Inlet Manifold - Fabricated to take two or three injectors per port. Simple NA version for dual TBs or charged version with plenum for single TB.

Sensors:
Throttle Position Sensor
Coolant Temperature Sensor
Inlet Air Temperature Sensor
Crank Position Sensor
Phase Sensor (modded Dizzy or hall sensor for cam drive wheel)
Dual Oxygen Sensors with gauges

Fuel System:
Injectors - 2/4/6
Fuel Rails
Fuel Pump
Fuel Filter
Fuel Pressure Regulator

Ignition:
Coil Pack or Coil On/Near Plug or Logic Level Coils

Miscelaneous:
Trigger Wheel
Idle Air Control Valve
Looms

It will be priced up as packages with options. All parts would be new, nothing ex-scrappy.

Would this be of interest to anyone?

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


boostjunkie

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296 Posts
Member #: 9117
Senior Member

Northampton

Sounds great but not got that sort of cash this year, maybe next *wink*

Confessed addiction to everything mini


Nial

78 Posts
Member #: 9073
Advanced Member

Edinburgh

On 18th Oct, 2010 Paul S said:

It will be priced up as packages with options. All parts would be new, nothing ex-scrappy.

Would this be of interest to anyone?



Yes possibly but I've got a few bits I wouldn't need.

And £2K would need 'management' approval.


Nial.


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

160+ views and a couple of maybes.

I think I'll park that idea for now.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


ministef1

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730 Posts
Member #: 1791
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Cranleigh, surrey

think its the cost, its a brilliant product but not many people would want to spend £2k when still the most powerfull turbo 5 port a-series are on carb? just thinking out loud.......

"Cars are a lifetime of pain"


John

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10020 Posts
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Mongo

Barnsley, South Flatcapshire

I wouldn't give up on the idea Paul.

If you are going to build another cost it up and offer it out, you never know.

If something is worth doing, it's worth doing half of.


Nial

78 Posts
Member #: 9073
Advanced Member

Edinburgh

On 19th Oct, 2010 Paul S said:
160+ views and a couple of maybes.
I think I'll park that idea for now.



As John says don't give up just yet (specially if it'll save you money?).

You could do with publicising this a bit more, there is a good chance that you'll get people on Minifinity or The Mini Forum who are interested.


Nial


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

I think that once we have a few more cars using the Siamese code then people will take more interest.

I need to get the 1293 Turbo Miglia running and producing the goods, then there may be an indication of the benefits in peak horsepower terms over a carburetor.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


John

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10020 Posts
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Mongo

Barnsley, South Flatcapshire

TBH "peak" horsepower doesn't interest me. I want the mid range and part throttle driveability that a mapped injection system can offer.

If I can't accomplish this with the 5-port then the 7-port beckons *wink*

EDIT: Consider this me registering interest in this package, however if a 7-port injected solution can be had for the same sort of money then this may be the way to go.

Edited by John on 20th Oct, 2010.

If something is worth doing, it's worth doing half of.


jbelanger

1267 Posts
Member #: 831
Post Whore

Montreal, Canada

On 20th Oct, 2010 John said:
TBH "peak" horsepower doesn't interest me. I want the mid range and part throttle driveability that a mapped injection system can offer.

The advantage with a correctly designed EFI system is that you don't have to compromise on one to get the other.

Jean

http://www.jbperf.com/


Nial

78 Posts
Member #: 9073
Advanced Member

Edinburgh

On 20th Oct, 2010 John said:
TBH "peak" horsepower doesn't interest me. I want the mid range and part throttle driveability that a mapped injection system can offer.


Me too!

(And [whisper]better fuel consumption![/whisper])

Nial.

Edited by Nial on 20th Oct, 2010.


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland


On 20th Oct, 2010 John said:
Consider this me registering interest in this package, however if a 7-port injected solution can be had for the same sort of money then this may be the way to go.


This is considerably cheaper than a 7 Port option. You will still need all of the above, plus the cylinder head.

As for mid-range torque and driveability, my 998Ti has bags of it. It is very smooth to drive and has the feel of a modern car.

The other thing to consider is that the EFi opens up the options of boost control, launch control, traction control, data logging etc. Plus you will only need a rolling road to establish the optimum ignition timing.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


welshdan

2095 Posts
Member #: 1111
Post Whore

s wales

its a good idea. it hink what you are up against is the lack of spare cash most people have at the moment

dan


MarkGTT

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Shropshire.

i think 2k for this is a bargain, great work Paul.


Rod S

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5988 Posts
Member #: 2024
Formally Retired

Rural Suffolk

For what it's worth, I think you summed it up yourself....

On 20th Oct, 2010 Paul S said:
I think that once we have a few more cars using the Siamese code then people will take more interest.


In the UK I'm only aware of three of us who are actually running it at the moment which covers you (turbo 998 on the road for over a year), Graham (std 998 on the road but experimenting with sequential injection) and myself (turbo, but just running it for testing in the garage at the moment as the car isn't finished).

Not really a good advert at the moment despite our progress.

Anyone with an SU can beat us easily so far :)

The other point is we've all done it different ways - your second version for the Miglia is significantly different to your first version, just as my second version will be different to my first. Graham's is different too - and so on.... there won't be five the same soon.

So, you're right, we need more people to give it a try.

The code Jean wrote is now superb in its flexibility to set the injection sequence however we want (you, me and Graham are all doing it differently) but there is no standard yet - ether in the physical hardware or the way to use the code.

That's the problem in trying to progress it at the moment, no obvious best way and R&D comes expensive.



BTW, this is not intended to be negative - I've spent too much for that, just to try to put some perspective on the issue.

Schrödinger's cat - so which one am I ???


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

Make that 6 as this latest one is NA 1380. The intention is to get some comparible data with a Weber carb.

That is if I can keep Sturgeo on track. He keeps drifting off towards Skylines at the moment :(

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


paul wiginton
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Milton Keynes

Ive honestly never been interested but if youre doing a 1380 NA Ill be watching the progress.
What spec would it be?

Paul

I seriously doubt it!


wolfie

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Somewhere around Swindon

i think 2k is cheap

Crystal Sound Audio said:

Why wolfie...you should have your name as Fuckfaceshithead !


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foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools."-Douglas Adams


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland


On 20th Oct, 2010 paul wiginton said:
Ive honestly never been interested but if youre doing a 1380 NA Ill be watching the progress.
What spec would it be?

Paul


This thread:

http://www.turbominis.co.uk/forums/index.php?p=vt&tid=380668

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


paul wiginton
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9 times Avon Park Class C winner

Milton Keynes

Ah, ofcourse - silly me

I seriously doubt it!


Brett

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Doncaster, South Yorkshire

just logging my interest, i dont intend on having efi straight away but definitely in the future, i am planning a 7port head to make it simpler but i have eyes on your mig :)

Yes i moved to the darkside *happy*

Instagram @jdm_brett


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland

The idea with building a high spec NA 1380 is that the available power from a 296 cam, 36/31 head and a Weber carb is well understood. This will give us a direct comparison.

The problem with any turbo engine is that it is difficult to make any direct comparisons due to too many variations.

Although I am building a high spec 998 Turbo that should be comparable with the TT2 or Graham Harveys car.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


Paul S

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8604 Posts
Member #: 573
Formerly Axel

Podland


On 20th Oct, 2010 Brett said:
just logging my interest, i dont intend on having efi straight away but definitely in the future, i am planning a 7port head to make it simpler but i have eyes on your mig :)


The 5 port EFi is not as simple as a 7/8 port, but the only additional feature that you have to set up is the injection timing table. This only takes a few hours on the road.

I am yet to be convinced that you need any more than two inlet ports to make real power with a turbo. On a 7/8 port head, you have twice the port, but they are only working for half the time. I know there is the issue of charge robbing, but with a long LCA cam and minimal overlap, that can be mimimised.

This is starting to sound like a sales pitch. That was not the intention but there seems to be a consensus that if you use injection you must have 4 inlet ports.

Saul Bellow - "A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
Stephen Hawking - "The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge."


joeybaby83

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Isle of Man

for what it offers, i think this is cheap too

think about it, £2k for a bolt on package that will give optimum running conditions for your engine, and further more any engine you ever buy

if i had the money at present i would be a definate yes, but one day i will and this is definately the route ill go down

but remember its not just the parts you will be getting, but the valuable time all these guys have put into the r&d to get it to this stage

"Turbo's make torque, and torque makes fun"

"did you know you can toast potato waffles?"



John

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Mongo

Barnsley, South Flatcapshire

I've been doing a bit of research and this is looking more attractive. I think further reading is in order. *smiley*

If something is worth doing, it's worth doing half of.

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