ot - Handling Question...
Turbo Mini Forums

If you have a car that is on (say) factory tyres, and has a tendancy to understeer, will changing the tyres to a much softer, grippier compound give the exsct same handling characteristics, just with a higher cornering speed?

In short - I'm not overly impressed with the understeer on my Legacy. If I power hard around a corner, the front end will get to a point then start to understeer. Easing off gently makes little difference - you have to come right off the accelerator. By following the traditional technique of unsettling the rear before a turn, it's easy to have a very nice high-speed cornering - initially... But the front end then starts washing out mid-turn!


Everyone one the 'forums' just says to buy new tyres, as this will eliminate the understeer. That just doesn't add up in my mind though... Surely changing the rubber on each corner will leave me with the same inherrent characteristics?

Thoughts?

All modern car out of factory is made to understeer... regardless what tyres you are using.
reason is for those people who cant drive, understeer is easy to know for people, its also act as "safety net"

Hi,
As the bulk of the weight is up front the front tyres will do more work than the rears, when cornering. Therefore the extra grip at the rear won't be noticable in that situation.
Or just stick the softer tyres on the front, leave the harder ones on the rear?
Cheers,
Gavin :)

Edited by Bat on 2nd Nov, 2006.

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have a play with the tire pressures before you go changing rubber, this can affect the way the car handles significantly, try a couple of pounds out of the front tires.

J

it will be the same if you alter nothing other than the tyres,

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Vroom, bat, imp.

I was actually looking for honest opinions of the handling characteristics based on changing nothing else but the rubber; in will short changing the tyres (all four) for a different compound etain the same characteristics???

i would say that changing the rubber wouldn't necessarily change the characteristic of the cars tendency to understeer, but would allow more cornering speed before doing so

I agree with above but I just thought understeer when pushed was standard on all 4WDs to a certain degree.

Sorry Dave, it's a Legacy. Look at it.. It's a grandma's car. They're built like that.

What about just changing the front tyres? It's got a middle diff to sort out this hasn't it? We did this to my mum's A6 Quattro, and it was much better afterwards.

The problem is that it is a 4wd Subaru. That is what they do. You have to change your driving style. However, I know changing the front tyres on my 'family' car made a massive difference. With crap old tyres it would wash out, but with a decent set of boots it was much better.

Like you say though the characteristics of the car won't fundamentally change, you are stuck with that. When I got out of my Lotus into my mates impreza I was understeering every where. They are not good at tight slow corners, they do come out of them fast though if you get it right.

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Watching the Imprezas at Combe the other day showed how slow they are around corners. Having said that - one word Alignment - check out the forums for Scoobies and you will find that most suffer Mini probs - not set up right from new!

On 5th Sep, 2011 Vegard said:
I stand corrected. You should know

My other car used to suffer from terrible understeer, until i fitted a front strut brace, which has dramatically improved the situtation with no other mods. Wether this would help your car is a different story...

Dave - changing the tyres will merely increase the speed, g, at which understeer will occur - you'd need to start changing the arbs'springs etc to get the car to fundamentaly change its characteristics.

or drive slower!

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Hi,
Land Rovers with permanent 4WD are the same.
I'd agree with whats said above, it's a 4wd thing, softer tyres will increase the grip making the understeer happen at higher cornering forces.
On the LR's we increase castor to fix it.
Cheers,
Gavin :)

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Thanks all - you confirmed my thoughts - and now allows me to figure out who REALLY doesn't know what they're talking about (on the subaru forum)....

I think some decent rubber all-round and a different rear roll-bar (for the us market they downsized from a 24mm to a 19mm bar) is on the cards after winter...

Edited by turbodave16v on 3rd Nov, 2006.

i can comment on 4wd but my lupo gti was crap in the wet and would under steer all the time, even at slow speeds and off the power. i changed the tyres from Dunlops to Continentals and it handles in the wet know. also general handling is better and now can over steer if provoced. when i say better, i meen much much better.

tyres shouldnt make a difference to a fundimental problem but it worked for me.

you could try a couple of bags of cement in the boot

my mate had a legacy turbo estate (like a hurse!) , a WRX estate then a STi estate.

the legacy understeered loads, the wrx less and te sti less still, but it was still a fair amount even on the sti, the brakes were bloody shite on the sti though, to the point of being dangerous.

Well, the legacy I've got understeers a lot less than the legacy that ended in 2004 for sure... I just found it a little disapointing that the handling was this way inclined.
The tyres on there are 'all season' covers, and 17" rims, so I'm pretty sure that a change of rubber will make a big difference. And the change of ARB will make it all i want it to be...

D

"all season"

it's not one of those sodding outback's i keep seeing whenever i'm in the states is it? LOL

my mates legacy was a 94 I think.

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your comparing to the mini dave..lol

Edited by turbodave16v on 4th Nov, 2006.

As a longterm Legacy driver I must be used to the way they drive, or my natural driving style suits the car. I I push it it's very neutral, followed by slight oversteer (It understeers round slow corners mind). I only have 170bhp though.

As above though, changing all 4 tyres won't fundamentally change the handling.

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